Stumped, need help
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Stumped, need help - 2/2/2006 12:39:27 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Hello all. I have a 94 4dr 4.3 that is having a very serious issue. About 3 weeks ago, while driving home, my truck just died on me. THe problem has been geting worse. Here recently my blazer will start, and run fine for about 10-15 minutes, then it sounds like it is missing(under acceleration). The problem seems to be mainly between 2500-3500RPM's. At park I can slowly give it throttle and at about 2500 rpm' it begings to sputter/miss. I have changed plugs, air filter and checked my spark, nothing wrong there. I have had to have it towed and had two mechanics look at it and they are stumped. The last mechanic said it it threw a code(???)that mabey suggeested an o2 sensor and that it appeared to be leaning out. Anyone had this problem, if so any suggestions would be nice. Btw, I am in alabama, so if anyone else lives in this god forbidden state let me know. Mabey a get-to-gether is in the future???
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/2/2006 1:32:31 PM
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Hanr3
Wheels & Tire Moderator
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Did they check your fuel pressure?
When is the last time you changed your fuel filter.
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'87 S10-Blazer - SOLD
'93 S10-Blazer 4x4x4 - Sons DD, engine swap is done.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/2/2006 1:47:06 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Actually, my fuel pump and pressure was checked yesterday at the mechanics. it was good. also, i changed my fuel filter 'bout a month ago. Would a carbon deposit cause this problem?
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/2/2006 4:02:25 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Just got back from another mechanic today. He scaned my blazer and charged me a whole 50 dollars to to tell me my truck is throwing a code 43, knock sensor. If anyone has had to deal with these let me know. I hope this wil fix my problem. BTW, I used some seafoam today and the problem got a litte better.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/2/2006 6:07:38 PM
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swartlkk
Posts: 14530
Joined: 5/1/2005
From: Waterloo, NY
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If this problem just, all of the sudden, started happening, I'm betting that the knock sensor is at fault. On my 2000 4.3L, the knock sensor is located on the bellhousing extension of the engine block under teh oil pressure sending unit, to the drivers side of the distributor. I'm not sure if it is in the same location on your 4.3L or not, but it shouldn't be all that bad to check that location.
I wouldn't think that carbon buildup would cause a problem so suddenly. If you wanted to, you could try a seafoam treatment which would serve to clear the carbon out of the valves & pistons to a certain extent. I'm about due for a second cleaning (probably this weekend) because I don't think the first run cleaned it enough.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/2/2006 7:34:54 PM
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magtec
Posts: 167
Joined: 2/2/2006
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not sure about the knock sensor code, but when our '94 jimmy started doing something similar, the problem turned out to be bad fuel return lines (it also had problems starting).
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 6:19:46 AM
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Hanr3
Wheels & Tire Moderator
Posts: 3482
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Crawl under your truck and beat on your cat. Does it rattle? Have you ever had it changed? Can your truck idle and run all day long if you keep it under 2K rpms?
You might be due for a new Cat?
_____________________________
"Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
The Marines don't have that problem."
-President Ronald Reagan
'87 S10-Blazer - SOLD
'93 S10-Blazer 4x4x4 - Sons DD, engine swap is done.
'00 S10-Blazer 4x4x4 - My
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 11:10:16 AM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Update. I finally broke down and bought two new knock sensors from O Really Expensive auto parts lastnight. I spent aobut one and a half hours moving crap out of the way just to remove and replace the back knock sensor. Pain in my ^$$. I replaced the driver side and rear sensor, pluged every thing up and tried to crank her. Nothing. It would turn over, start, then spit and sputter. CRAP!!! At the point I was about to thorw in the towel, I realized my truck was most likely 180 out. Yes I had to remove my plugs and cap to access the rear sensor. As I sat there, with my truck running like crap, I had a very rude awakeing. Sputter, Sputter, BOOM!!! Backfire. Very Loud. OW my ears. I had neighbors coming out of there apartments wondering what in the home of satan I had done this time. BTW, I am kinda known as the local redneck-DIY guy. I guess the backfire would not have been such a big deal, but considering I did not hace any type of plumbing before the throttle body and the only exhaust is a cherry bomb that has no after piping, just dumps, but IT WAS LOUD. I decided to give it up for the time being and will try to get it running today, hopefully without pissing off the neighbors. Just thought I would let ya'll know what was going on . Thanks for all your help. I will post some pics very soon. BTW, the cat is fine and my fuel return lines are ok. Thanks for your help. I am sure I will be back with more questions in the future.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 1:55:52 PM
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20Blazer00
Posts: 862
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You stated that you have replaced plugs, air filter, and voltages are fine, but did you inspect/replace cap. One thread mentioned that a small hairline crack in the cap/rotor was his problem...sometimes you have to dig a little deeper in the forums to find a solution... Also have you had the ignition module checked it might be worn or a wire is coroded and not making good contact.
< Message edited by 20Blazer00 -- 2/4/2006 1:57:57 PM >
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2000 Blazer LS 4dr 4.3L Auto
1999 Grand Am 3.4L 4dr SE2 - Traded
2000 Honda Odyssey 3.5L 5dr Mini-Van
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 4:25:35 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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I am pretty sure my problem is more along the lines of timing/plug placement. I did make any attempt to remember what plug wire went where. Now I am stuck with trying to find a shop that would know the firing order, and cylinder numbers on my truck I am so fustrated with myself. Guess I just wasnt thinking due the fact that I was outside late last night. Does anyone know the correct firing order/cylinder bank numbers on a 1994 S10 Blazer(boxy style) 4.3w code on the vin, auto transmission 2wd. Any helpm would be apreciated. Also, if the only thing I removed is the dist. cap, will i have to adjust the iming?
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 5:53:35 PM
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swartlkk
Posts: 14530
Joined: 5/1/2005
From: Waterloo, NY
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Firing order is 1-6-5-4-3-2 and the distributor rotates clockwise. If you only removed the cap, and didn't rotate the distributor, then you shouldn't need to reset the timing. Cylinder 1 is the front cylinder on the bank that has the cylinder head pushed forward further than the other (IIRC, its the drivers on my 2k, but it's been awhile since I've screwed around with that). Which ever side has cyl#1 has 3 & 5 as well, then the other side would go 2,4,6.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 7:52:09 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Thanks for the info on the firing order. Is the #1 generally on the passenger side closest to the radiator? Also, the #1on the cap at the 7 o'clock posistion? If the 1 cylinder is on the pass side, i have already tried to run my wires that way and it still ran really rough. sounded kinda lik and airplane. I did not take the rotor out, jsut the cap. Would seaform cause it to run like crap? Just a thought.
Josh
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 8:06:01 PM
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4lowlife
Posts: 1562
Joined: 12/29/2005
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quote:
Thanks for the info on the firing order. Is the #1 generally on the passenger side closest to the radiator? Also, the #1on the cap at the 7 o'clock posistion? If the 1 cylinder is on the pass side, i have already tried to run my wires that way and it still ran really rough. sounded kinda lik and airplane. I did not take the rotor out, jsut the cap. Would seaform cause it to run like crap? Just a thought.
#2 is locatd closest to the radiator and the pass side, then the one behind it is #4 And #6 is is closest to the heater core.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 8:10:00 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Cool. UR sure 246 is on pass and 135 on drivers? Does drivers read the same, front to back? Sorry for the stupid ?'s, i am kinda new at this type of tinkering. I usually only mess with car audio.BTW, where is the first contact point on the cap, 7 o'clock? then just go clockwise? 1,2,3 etc...?
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 8:15:26 PM
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swartlkk
Posts: 14530
Joined: 5/1/2005
From: Waterloo, NY
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I'm not sure where the #1 cylinder should be on the cap, but to find out, turn the motor over to compression on #1. To do this, pull the plugs and turn the motor over with the starter. Place your finger over the plug hole for #1 cylinder (front drivers side). When your finger gets blown out of the way, then you're on compression on the #1 cylinder. From there, you can pull the cap and take a look at the rotor location. Since the distributor rotates clockwise, you'll want the wire terminal that is closest to the rotor position in the clockwise direction. Mark this as your #1 terminal.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 9:10:38 PM
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94_4.3dago
Posts: 16
Joined: 1/23/2006
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Thanks for the help.. No such luck starting though. Had to have my lady jump me off and all my truck did was spin. UGH. I think though that my dist cap may be loose. I will tighten that tommorow when I have sunlight. I replaced my plugs on the dist in the 1,6,5,4,3,2 that was recomended. I hope this travesty ends tommorow.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/4/2006 9:56:46 PM
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4lowlife
Posts: 1562
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6 distrib 5
4 cap 1
2 3
6 engine 5
4 3
2 1
____radiator________
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/5/2006 10:17:36 AM
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swartlkk
Posts: 14530
Joined: 5/1/2005
From: Waterloo, NY
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That is true for your distributor design, but I'm not sure if that is the way that the CPI motors with a more traditional cap (ie wires out the top). Based off of that Distributor cap routing, the 1-6-5-4-3-2 firing order would not work on the older caps. The reason why it works on the newer engines is because of the internal (to the cap) routing of the terminals. If you look on the top of your cap, you'll see a trace of where the terminals actually go from the pins inside to the plug outside.
< Message edited by swartlkk -- 2/5/2006 10:21:55 AM >
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/6/2006 9:45:05 PM
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blazingsadle
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Hey dude, buy a manual, book before proceeding any further , PLEEEEZZE. Cause what you're getting here is some serious funny information. You never should have started on the problem without a book. Not knowing the firing order or where cylinder one is are serious giveaways.
Do you know where your timing mark is on that thing? Bring her up to top dead center for cylinder 1 NOT 4. This would be accomplished by MANUAL rotation of the engine in the clockwise direction via the crank, till you get to the ZERO mark on the timing tab. If I were you, I would have the driver side valve cover removed and watch the cylinder closest to the radiator closely. This is cylinder number one, for sure. While looking at the rocker arms for cyl number one, make sure they are moving while turning the engine. Moving JUST BEFORE the zero mark on the timing tab. If they are, cylinder one is top dead center. If they are not, the same spot is cyl 4's top dead center or 180 out. I like to pay attention to 4 if I have the whole engine open, but 4 is on the other side and no sense opening yourself up to two leaking valve covers.
BTW the factory commited a very drastic sin in the horizontal cap arrangement if that is what you have. The cylinder number one wire is not the furthest forward as one would think. On the drivers side of such caps the cylinders are 3,1,5 from front to back. On the other side, passenger, the cylinders are 2,4,6, front to back. FRONT of car to back of car in both cases. The sin being that a stupid cap made on purpose to arrange things nicely for the wires was messed up due to the cylinders not being in the correct order on the ODD (drivers) side. This has messed up many a dude with no book. Wires to the cylinder 1 and 3 are actually SUPPOSED to be reversed, between the engine and the cap. Get it?
Now, if you happen to have a "normal" (vertical) cap the cylinder 1 position will be the right one of the two directly facing the engine. In other words, two cylinders will face the front of the engine compartment together. make sure that the distributor is retuned to the same appearing LOGICA location as it was with two towers facing forward. The number one cylinder should be the one on the drivers side. Same as where the location of the cylinder actually is. The rotor should face this way, pointing at the tower (under cap) when lined up right. The firing order is 165432 and I dont have any doubts about it at all. That means the plug wire following cyl 1 will be 6. And so on.
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RE: Stumped, need help - 2/6/2006 10:00:41 PM
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blazingsadle
Posts: 237
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Read a couple of other things from between the lines of this post. Cherry bombs?? Are you running a true dual with no tail pipes? No cat(s), just cherry bombs? Had all that long? Or just long enough to mess up the sensors running things for the computer. Do you still have your O2 sensors? Checked the operation of the local egr lately? Bet it doesnt much like the situation? If you have no cat converter and true duals, I see little hope in keeping that vehicle running smoothly unless you are willing to modify your computer. I can't help you there. I am one that likes to see true dual cats and if you really need the sound of dual cherry bombs, I cant stop that.
The 94 and 95 cpi models are some of the best running higher horsepower models out there, straight from the factories. Before modifying the exhausts and intakes on these, some serious considerations of the computer functions and interdependencies of all the sensors will have to be studied. No such thing as just jumping in there.
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