pontiac sunfire UP DATE!!! PICS!!!!
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pontiac sunfire UP DATE!!! PICS!!!! - 4/3/2007 2:03:42 AM
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Zygoat
Posts: 214
Joined: 6/24/2006
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THATS RIGHT this post is about a pontiact sunfire. its my sisters car i am pretty sure the engine is siezed. i was hoping you guys could help in general with what would need to be done to rubild a seized engine. i posted on the j-body forums(turns out thats what their called), but no help at all from them. heres what i posted
quote:
i am here for my sister, she owns a 97 Pontiac Sunfire with the 2.4l, its a 5 speed. i was home this weekend, and i heard her car running, not good, so i took it to and auto parts store, to get the codes pulled, they could not do it because they said their was something wrong with the obd port. this is not my main concern, and it worked some time back when we had them pulled earlier.
my main concern, is that when i went to leave its had a very rough time of turning over and did not start, i let it rest and tried again, same thing only this time even slower crank, i let it rest and tried again, nothing, i can hear the starter click and try to engage,but would not even turn the engine at all, and it was turning over just seconds before. i had the battery tested on the spot it was fine, i called my dad to come and tow it home. while he towed me in the parking lot we tried to start it by dropping the clutch in gear, the wheels were completely locked and would not turn at all as soon as the clutch was engaged. i believe the motor is seized. what parts do you think might have been damaged, where can i get good replacements. i need more information on the internals of the engine because i am unfamiliar with it. what size are the pistons, rods, so on and so forth.
also before it broke is was stumbling, but in a regular way, ie the pattern kept repeating, also there was a very audible knock, that happened a few to maybe 5 times a second at idle(i didn't count)
she just had her oil changed last week, and it had apparently been a long time before that, they said it still had oil but that it was very old. also when i looked under the car the solid coolant line that ran from the bottom of the radiator to the engine, was smashed almost completely closed, despite this the temp never got the least bit hot when i drove it.
i hope you guys can help and i hope this gives you what you need, i am going to try to tear apart her engine this weekend, so hopefully you guys can let me know what i need by then.
i figure new piston rings are a givin, will i need to have the block machined? also i know any other parts that are broken or damaged but are their any other things that will have to be replaced no matter what?
thanks for the help guys.
< Message edited by Zygoat -- 5/20/2007 3:36:20 PM >
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97 blazer zr2 4x4 2dr 4.3l
e fans, audiovox ax 901 w/remote start, flowmaster 50series suv custom catback dual out, turbo in the works.
exhaust vid: http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u166/Zygoat_D/blazer/?action=view¤t=Tazer_Exhaust_clip.flv
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 2:05:10 AM
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Zygoat
Posts: 214
Joined: 6/24/2006
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as un update we towed it to a local shop they replaced the starter and it made no diffrence just as i thought.
also when we had the codes pulled before, they were the crank and cam position sensors, i believe, its been a while. they were NOT replaced and so i think they played a major role in the stumbeling.
< Message edited by Zygoat -- 4/3/2007 2:10:12 AM >
_____________________________
97 blazer zr2 4x4 2dr 4.3l
e fans, audiovox ax 901 w/remote start, flowmaster 50series suv custom catback dual out, turbo in the works.
exhaust vid: http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u166/Zygoat_D/blazer/?action=view¤t=Tazer_Exhaust_clip.flv
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 3:37:04 AM
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4lowlife
Posts: 1562
Joined: 12/29/2005
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Dummy light on? Oil lamp?
My buds 1998 Z24 cavvy dumped too. Spun a crank bearing. Idiot light was on for a year before he had it looked at.
He got an '07 Ion. same motor! 2.4 litre. They just ended Ion production last Wed in TN btw.
It was a sign it was too late.
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 4:21:36 AM
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TheBrettster
Posts: 1080
Joined: 7/3/2006
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Might be cheaper to just go ahead and replace the engine with a used one.
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 11:25:27 AM
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4lowlife
Posts: 1562
Joined: 12/29/2005
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If it can't be turned over I would get another car. sorry man.
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 3:15:21 PM
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Zygoat
Posts: 214
Joined: 6/24/2006
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yea i know but its my sisters and she doesnt have alot of cash so i am hoping that i can rebuild it for her at just the cost of parts.
_____________________________
97 blazer zr2 4x4 2dr 4.3l
e fans, audiovox ax 901 w/remote start, flowmaster 50series suv custom catback dual out, turbo in the works.
exhaust vid: http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u166/Zygoat_D/blazer/?action=view¤t=Tazer_Exhaust_clip.flv
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 3:31:59 PM
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Chevy Lover
General Tech Moderator
Posts: 3411
Joined: 6/11/2006
From: Vancouver. B.C. Canada
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Well, you can go ahead and pull the engine apart to see if you can find the problem and repair it. Personally, I think I would check for a used engine (with a warranty) and just put that in.
When you consider the time, parts, gaskets etc involved in an engine repair for a '97 Sunfire, it might actually be faster and less expensive to just put in a used engine.
Just my opinion.
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Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day, teach a man to fish, and he will sit on a boat drinking beer for a life time
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 7:20:21 PM
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lastcoupe
Posts: 1137
Joined: 7/27/2006
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I'd bet you have hydrolocked the engine due to coolant in the cylinders from a blown head gasket. That's the good news...if it has locked when you dumped the clutch you may have bent a rod...you need to pull the head off and have it pressure checked and straight-edeged first.....but you probably have caused more damage bro.
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ASE & GM certified Pro Auto Technician
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/3/2007 11:45:00 PM
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Zygoat
Posts: 214
Joined: 6/24/2006
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yea, thanks for the info lastcoupe but the road was gravely and the tires just broke loose imedetly, you might be right but i am hoping that its ok i think it probably is, i wasnt terribly violent with it. so you think a new head gasket will fix them problem if that is the case and i didnt f*it up more.
_____________________________
97 blazer zr2 4x4 2dr 4.3l
e fans, audiovox ax 901 w/remote start, flowmaster 50series suv custom catback dual out, turbo in the works.
exhaust vid: http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u166/Zygoat_D/blazer/?action=view¤t=Tazer_Exhaust_clip.flv
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/4/2007 10:40:32 AM
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swartlkk
Posts: 14499
Joined: 5/1/2005
From: Waterloo, NY
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Definitely! Should be able to pull the plugs and if thing is ok, rotate the crank fairly easily...
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04 Rainier
My Restoration Projects
Please Do Not PM for Tech Help
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 4/5/2007 6:35:37 AM
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Zygoat
Posts: 214
Joined: 6/24/2006
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if i did infact bend one of the rods how would i know, is a visual inspection the only way, because if thats the case i basicaly have to tear the motor down to the block.
_____________________________
97 blazer zr2 4x4 2dr 4.3l
e fans, audiovox ax 901 w/remote start, flowmaster 50series suv custom catback dual out, turbo in the works.
exhaust vid: http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u166/Zygoat_D/blazer/?action=view¤t=Tazer_Exhaust_clip.flv
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RE: pontiac sunfire - 5/1/2007 2:45:45 AM
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Zygoat
Posts: 214
Joined: 6/24/2006
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ok here is an up date!!!
for the last 4 weekends i have been working on my sisters car. which is y i have pretty much dissapered from the forums recently.
i started by disassembeling the motor. i took out the spark plugs and discovered some interesting things.
1. cyl.1 and 3 were completly usless #1 spark plugg was completely destroyed( in a way i have never seen, not even in pictures)
#3 Plug was bent so that the contacts were touching.
2. i peered into the cyl through the spark plug holes and i could see metal shavings in the #1 cyl.
they were all coplelty black and coverd it wat looked like cacked on oil.
after seeing that i decided to pull the cam covers (maily because they were easy to get to). they looked perfect, never seen any better. at this point i was some what puzzeled. what could have caused that kind of damage to the spark plugs and metal shaving to be in the combustion chamber? we tried to start it and their was absolutly no diffrence at all(ruling out vapor lock) i decided the best coa was to pull the motor and tear it apart untill i could see exactly what was going on.
that took another entire weekend.
3 weekes in now and i had the motor on an engine stand i began tearing it down. i pulled off the oil pan and discovered the #1 piston was cracked on the side wall and their was a hole punched in the top (not good). i could not understand what could have caused that givin that the cams look fine. i decided to pull the head off complely(which is a major pita on the in-line 2.4l) when i got the head off it was a scene of total devistation.
both of the exhaust valve heads were broken off in the #1 cyl and sitting on the piston. both were exactly the same for the #3 cyl and 1 valve was broken on the #4 cyl. meaning that the car was effectivly running on 1 cylender. the head itself was also smashed by the valve heads that had broken off and been slamed into the head by the pistons. we, at this point, elected to get a new motor. i was however completly amazed at the lack of colateral damage. asid form the head valves and pistons their was virtualy no damage to speak off. i am completly confident that i could have replaced the afore mentioned and the car would have ran fine. really amazing.
i eventualy determined that the timing chain tensioner malfunctioned, eaither mechanicaly or by a falty install (it apperes that some one whas in the timing chain area recently, there were brand new gaskets all around). when the tensioner broke it allowed chain motion that eventualy caused one of the guides to break as well. this allowed the timing chain to skip teeth on the exhaust cam and thus push the valves down at the wrong point during the stroke. causing the valves and pistons to collide and the valves to break. the timing gears actualy skipped on me when i was trying to remove the timing chain cam bolts.
having figured it out and ordered a new engine this last weekend i placed the new engine in. we are still waiting for the crank and cam position sensors and i will finish hooking up the rest of the electrical and loose ends this weekend. it should be running then (fingers crossed).
ill let you guys know how it turned out and hopefuly post some pics next week.
< Message edited by Zygoat -- 5/20/2007 3:39:35 PM >
_____________________________
97 blazer zr2 4x4 2dr 4.3l
e fans, audiovox ax 901 w/remote start, flowmaster 50series suv custom catback dual out, turbo in the works.
exhaust vid: http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u166/Zygoat_D/blazer/?action=view¤t=Tazer_Exhaust_clip.flv
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