damn thing wont start
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damn thing wont start - 11/14/2005 12:58:32 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
Status: offline
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ok now im the 1 who put new engine in 2 weeks ago and after timing was adjusted it started first time key was turned and it was doin that just fine for the first week and now for past lets say 5 days its been gettin a little harder to start its been makin me crank it a little longer before itll fire and now it wont start at all. i can hear the fuel pump comin on it has new distributor cap and rotor new wires and plugs and new fuel filter all put on with new engine. we sprayed starting fluid in the throttle body and it started and ran as long as there was starting fluid in there but i didnt want to blow it up so we only sparyed it for a few seconds. i even changed the coil thinkin it wasnt gettin spark or sufficient spark but that wasnt it either. i know it has fuel to the intake but im not sure from there and im really gettin pissed so any ideas would really help. its a 96 s10 4.3 v6 with the "w" type engine and im not sure if it could have something to do with the spider lookin thing under the plastic intake so please some1 give me an idea of what could be wrong here. thank you very much
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/14/2005 1:00:46 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
Status: offline
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oh yeah and i forgot its not givin me any codes tellin me anything is wrong thats why im stumped i have the scanner and plugged it in even with the engine runnin with the ether it didnt register any code except the maf sensor but that was because the air intake was off so i know thats why that code was there but no clue on anything else. please help
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/14/2005 3:20:39 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
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ok now i dont know whats goin on my step dad brought me some dry gas stuff an some injector cleaner and i put in the dry gas and then pushed the pressure check valve on the fuel line up by the intake and it didnt start so i pu t a lil ether in there so my step dad could hear it and it fired right up and still runnin been bout 15minutes no clue whats goin on with it . id still like to hear any ideas or advice if u have any. step dad says it could jus be ****ty gas from where i been gettin it or from sittin so long. who knows
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/14/2005 4:33:31 PM
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drkmelvin
Posts: 463
Joined: 10/21/2005
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That is possible... we had some no name gas stations that were selling cut gas, and my truck wouldn't run on it. Always get gas from at least a somewhat respectable gas station
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/14/2005 9:58:22 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
Status: offline
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more trouble now after i got it started the first time i was affraid to shut it off so it ran for 3hours an then i had to shut it off and it wouldnt start back up so i did the same thing checked pressure valve and then used a touch of starting fluid and again it fired right up. so then 2 hours after that still runnin i get up to about 55-60 and it dies in middle of road so again i check pressure an try to start an nothin so i top it off with ether and it fires up. i know i cant keep doin this i dont like doin it now im affraid im gonna blow throtle body up does any1 have an idea as to what is wrong with my truck it still isnt givin me any codes except the transmission slip p1870 and now i can feel it between 1st and 2nd it jerks hard. so what am i gonna do please help me some1
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/15/2005 7:43:43 AM
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00ZR2BLZRGUY
Posts: 10
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline
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Hey,
Well I think you somewhat stumbled on 2 the main cause of your problem.. Your problem with the engine is that it is not reciving any fuel when it cuts out, Thats why it will start when you spray down the TB. To test this theroy you can depress the fuel rail test valve only on a cold engine."Its like a tire valve", have a rag ready and "wear some eye protection" because it will spray fuel if the line is charged, If you have no fuel spray, then you have no fuel pressure. Im guessing you have a fuel pump thats on its way out, a bad one can work when it wants to, usually working fine for a few minutes then gradually getting worse psi until cuttout. Try doublechecking all your fuses inside and under the hood, maybe even a wiggle test of the connection leading 2 the fuel pump. It could even be possable that when the motor was replaced a few wires could have been damaged. I think you said you installed a new fuel filter,check it to see if the directional arrow is pointing at the engine. As far as the tranny goes I cant help ya there, I just shelled out 2 grand on my 00 blazers tranny rebuild. Gl and hope this helps.
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/15/2005 11:46:57 AM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
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well the trany was rebuilt jus prior to the new engine install so im just gonna take it back and have it fixed cuz its still under warranty. and with the fuel prob i checked the filter its good right direction an all but i dont understand why it wont give me a code if the pumps goin bad because this truck has codes for everything including pump and pressure. the first time i checked the valve id dribbled out the 2nd time it sprayed and then again it just dribbled out so i figured there might be a problem with the pump but i dont know which wires control the pump from the front of the truck so i dont know which ones to test or wiggle and another thing is i can hear the pump come on everytime i turn the key i specifcly listened for that when i first had the trouble that was my first theory of the problem. so now im thinkin it could be getting clogged enough to where it wont push the right amount of fuel or it could be going bad. well see and im sure im not done with this problem yet so ill prolly be back for more questions...... i hope some smart ass didnt put a ping pong ball in my tank?
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/15/2005 4:34:41 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
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now im startin to get upset i took the truck to the tranny shop to have them fix what they messed up. so they hook up their $4000 snap on computer and its tellin them the o2 sensor has a problem and thats it no stored sodes or anything like that but it does have alot of stuff like voltage to sensors an alot of good diagnostic crap and i told the guy well its wrong cuz i checked it with my $100 acutron scanner and the only code its givin me is the p1870 that its been givin me so he was stumped as to why me cheap 1 reads what his expensive one cant. so he trys to erase it and the truck has to be off but the ignition on and when i went to start it to go to the shop it started 1st turn of the key but when he did that he had to try 4 times before it would start and then agin he shut it off and it took another 3 times before it would start so now im stumped as to whats causing my truck not to start because again his $4000 computer didnt say nothin about why it wouldnt start jus like my computer wouldnt.WHAT IS WRONG????????? why no codes for fuel problems or anything like that ?????????
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/15/2005 5:59:09 PM
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00ZR2BLZRGUY
Posts: 10
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline
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hmmm,
Well Im still convinced that the problem with not starting is fuel related, Im thinking that your new fuel filter could have an intermintant blockage? Just because you buy a new part does not mean that it is perfect, many new parts are defective right out of the box. You said that you tried the poor mans fuel pressure test and a few times it only dribbled out and didnt spray, Thats not good since it should always be spraying showing that your fuel system is charged. For the wiggle test Id suggest finding your fuel pump plug in on the gas tank and make sure its not corroded in any way. Something has got to be causing that fuel to not reach your engine the way it should. I wish I could help you more but without being there to tinker around with it I can only make educated guesses. Im glad 2 hear that your tranny is covered on the warrenty, with hard shifting they need 2 fix that, Id also crawl under your rig and take a look at all the sensor connections, linkages, and plug ins that they may have touched. When I brought my 2000 home I found the block heater unplugged and a wiring harness not properly fastened. Also.. are the bulbs working for the warning lights? Well try this stuff and be real observant of anything that looks out of place. Good luck man.
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/16/2005 9:23:04 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
Status: offline
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well trannys good now they said they redid the valve packs and it feels alot better no slippin and smooth shiftin into all the gears. and as soon as i got there it started first try and i stopped about 10 times and it started right up everytime so i dont know now. maybe they did somethin to it case it wasnt startin for them i dont know but im sure ill let u know if it keeps happenin
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/17/2005 5:05:32 PM
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nslide10
Posts: 52
Joined: 10/20/2005
Status: offline
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now im really gettin pissed. i went out this mornin and started it first time i went and picked up my babymomma and my new baby and took em to store and home and it started fine each time i prolly shut it of 5 or 6 times and it restarted no problem then i came home to get my son outta school and i try to start it and it wont start again . i layed underneath to listen for fuel pump and heard it but it kinda sounded like it was blowin bubbles in the tank and when i checked pressure valve it sprayed out but had a couple air pockets in the line so now im wonderin again what it could be. again any ideas would be helpful. thank you
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/18/2005 1:31:47 PM
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Hanr3
Wheels & Tire Moderator
Posts: 3476
Joined: 5/11/2005
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The more I read about your trouble the more I agree it is fuel related. Specifically its your fuel pump or Fuel Pressure Regulator . Let me explain why. Once your truck is running you need about 3-10psi less pressure then at start up. Your truck isn't starting on its own becuase the fuel pump cannot generate enough pressure, or the regulaotr cannot hold that much pressure. Once you get it going with the either, it runs becuase your fuel pump and regulator can maintain that pressure.
There won't be any codes for this. There is nothing to record, there is no fuel pressure gauge on our trucks. Fuel pressure is not monitored. No way for the pcm to store a code it doesn't monitor.
There is the possibility it is your fuel pressure regulator. The regulator is located in that spider looking thing on top of the engine. Yea, the intake manifold. When you take the top half of the intake off notice how dirty it is under there. If the area around the fuel pressure regulator is clean, it needs to be replaced. It is leaking fuel, the fuel is cleaning the carbon. Check all the fuel lines as well for leaks. Replace anything you suspect is leaking.
Get a Haynes manual, it has the fuel pressure needed at start up. I am at work right now orI would look it up for you. Find someone with a fuel pressure gauge and put in it on the schradder valve. What kind of pressure are you getting? If it mets spec, then I would guess your problem lies int eh fuel pressure regulator. If it doesn't met spec, time to drop the gas tank. Post up what you find out.
_____________________________
"Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference.
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'87 S10-Blazer - SOLD
'93 S10-Blazer 4x4x4 - Sons DD, engine swap is done.
'00 S10-Blazer 4x4x4 - My
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RE: damn thing wont start - 11/18/2005 5:09:57 PM
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stmanser
Posts: 23
Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline
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i have been having the same problems with starting and not startiong
i have replced the fuel pump in mine 3 times in the last 4 weeks.. and the last one i put in was a Bosch fuel pump.. and it too is bad.. wnet bad in tuesday.. so i am dropping the tank tonight.......... AGAIN........this time i am buying the Ac Delco pump... i want a walbro 307.. but i cant find one cheap enough and cant get it tonight...
wha ti have to say is this
the fuel pump has to be at 54-64 PSI.. anythting below that and it probably wont start... if it is sucking air.. it means the pump is cavitating.. either from a hole in the feed line in the tank, or a bad fuel pump... air in the fuel line is bad.. cars run off gas.. not air...
i am willing to bet that your fuel pump is either not getting the correct signal from the fuel injectors, or the pump is going bad. i think the fuel pump going bad is the culprit..and you can check this by hooking up a fuel pressure gauge to the "shrader" valve on the back of the intake and see what you are reading...
when you turn the key on the following should happen
1. pump comes on and goes to 54-64 psi
2. you will hear a click from the fuel pump relay and the pump will shut off
3. and the pressure should stay up there.. might bleed off a bit.. but it should stay
4. when the pressure has stabilized, depress the by pass button, (Bleeder) and allow fuel to come out the small hose
5. if pressure drops off, turn the key back on and keep the bleeder button depressed
6. put the end in a bucket and see the fuel come out.. make sure it isnt dirty nasty fuel
7. make sure no air is blowing out of the bypass hose.
8. try starting the truck and then press the bypass button with truck running
9. do the same steps with the bleeder and all that..
what these will all do for you is see if the pump is performing correctly. if you get air or no or little pressure... suspect the bad fuel pump . or bad fuel pressure regulator...
hope this helps.. i have been going through all this for the past month, i am so tired of it.. im ready to blow the truck up.. :)|
< Message edited by stmanser -- 11/18/2005 5:12:08 PM >
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